The second film, The Decline of Western Civilization Part II: The Metal Years (1988), covers the Los Angeles heavy metal scene of 19871988. Featuring concert footage of Los Angeles punk bands and interviews both with band members, the publishers of Slash fanzine, and with the punks who made up their audience, the film offers a look into a subculture that was largely ignored by the rock music press of the time. Theyre not particularly high def; then again, the grittiness and grime are a part of the overall aesthetic, so you wouldnt want them to get too dressed up. See Roger Kimballs 1986 review in the New Criterion here. November 6, 2020. We were young and stupid but, no, we didnt always hang out in a hot tub. Theres also a commentary track from Spheeris, as well as additional commentary from Foo Fighters and Nirvanas Dave Grohl. See David Wrights 2015 review at Memoria Press here. The Decline of Western Civilization is a 1981 American documentary filmed through 1979 and 1980. I went on an aversion therapy program to quit drinkin. This was partly due to Spheeris refusing to relinquish the rights to the first two parts of the trilogy in order to enable the third to be released. 'OK, cool, let's go get some beer. [1], The film's title is possibly a reference to music critic Lester Bangs' 1970 two-part review of the Stooges' album Fun House, for Creem magazine, where Bangs quotes a friend who had said the popularity of the Stooges signaled "the decline of Western civilization". PopMatters is wholly independent, women-owned and operated. When you do a record deal, dont trust anybody, especially your best friend. 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Key Scene 2: Darby Crash and girlfriend Michelle laugh about finding the dead body of a house painter. Influencers: Profiles of a Partnership 2022, How to Pitch Stories and Articles to IndieWire, Best Black Friday TV and Movie Deals: Criterion Box Sets, 'Venom: Let There Be Carnage,' and More, Best TV & Movie Box Sets: Criterion Collection, TV Classics, and More, Oscars 2023: Best Makeup and Hairstyling Predictions, Oscars 2023: Best Visual Effects Predictions. If I was still drinkin Id be dead now. God instructed Adam to obey his Word . For a movie about the underground punk scene, the . Its cheaper to live in Vegas, and theres lots of work out here and a great club scene. Still, even without that, this is well worth your time and attention. For the purposes of this article, the "West" is that civilization which grew up in western Europe after the end of the Roman Empire.. Its roots lay in the civilizations of ancient Greece and Rome (which themselves built on foundations laid in ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia).. Takes on Hollywoods Bias Against Women Directors (and Women Directors Respond). The Decline of Western Civilization R 1 hour 40 min 1981 by J.R. Jones October 26, 1985 August 26, 2021. Germs singer Darby Crash appears on the soundtrack album cover. Doug Casey: Western Civilization has its origins in ancient Greece. Im sure that movie did enhance our career. I spotted troll sitting in front of a liquor store with a 32pack and pulled over and gave him a ride..i recognized him from the decline but was not completely sure since he was like 25years older and didnt want to ask..we ended up drinking with him all night then it became apparent that it really was him since people kept coming up to him and taking pictures and yelling out "the decline!" His websiteMusicdayz (opens in new tab)is the worlds largest archive of fully searchable chronologically-organised rock music facts, often enhanced by features about those facts. It ought to be. This new sleekness doesn't make "Decline, Part III" any less a gritty tour de force, however. Your Privacy Choices (Opt Out of Sale/Targeted Ads). Spheeris talks to homeless teenagers living on the street or squatting in abandoned buildings in Los Angeles, an unstable mother, Los Angeles Police Department officer Gary Fredo, and a paralyzed youth living on disability benefits. Government corruption and . (Long sigh) I had the thumb on me, controlling me. Faster Pussycat broke up in 1993, because the whole scene had changed. She was lookin for bands that were staples on the LA music scene, and Odin certainly was that. When we supported Poison in 1986 in San Diego they did not want the riser, they wanted it down. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. A look into the Los Angeles punk rock scene, that was largely ignored by the rock music press of the time. "It's been a year of pure hell," filmmaker Penelope Spheeris says with a laugh. It was supposed to be on the Sunday, but Penelope called me Saturday morning and goes: Can you film it today, Chris? I go: I been up for three days, partying since I got home from London. And she goes: Well, do you mind? And I go: No. And right when I was goin out the door, my mom pulled up. In the third installment of Penelope Spheeris' "Decline" series, being young in a leather jacket isn't what it used to be. I was starting to hear about this stuff called the internet. I didnt think grunge would kill our shit, but it did pretty much. Chris Holmes, the towering guitarist with W.A.S.P., was central to the films most memorable scene, in which he mugged, hammed, drank and swore his way through an interview while perched precariously on a lilo in a swimming pool, watched by his evidently bemused mother. Whether you have a nostalgic connection to the subjects, or just want to glimpse into a couple of under-examined subcultures, this is a set well worth adding to your collection. As stand-alone documents, they respectively capture the nascent aggression of California hardcore, the poofed-hair pomp of Hollywood heavy metal and the squalor of life as a gutter punk. And still, others question the assumption behind the question and maintain that the . We stopped London/DPriest in 1992 after our manager deserted us. In the late 1990s it was released on CD as well. '", Spheeris says that she's working on a fourth Decline film with her daughter, Anna Fox. Strip away the glam, theres little else. Being a skateboarder, I was into punk and new wave, like 999, The Specials, Devo. "What can oppose the decline of the west is not a resurrected culture but the utopia that is silently contained in the image of its decline.". READ MORE:Sorry, Ladies: Study on Women in Film and Television Confirms the Worst, Penelope Spheeris, the films director, has a less romantic way of explaining the movies thriving underground market: theft. So whenever I would rent the record equipment for the record companies, I'd go moonlighting out the clubs and shoot the bands that I wanted to shoot. For some reason, beginning in the late fifteenth century, the little states of Western Europe, with their bastardized linguistic borrowings from There is no future in mind for anyone here. "It's like, it's not bullshit . The Asbury Revival, Emotionalism, and Group Psychology, 3 Books That Explain the Decline of Western Civilization, American Girl and the Historical Nostalgia Trap, Attentiveness as Service: The Virtue of Noticing, Not Your Schools Reading List 8: Adventures, Spies, and More for Young Boys. I know. Brought up in her fathers travelling carnival, Penelope Spheeris was the ideal person to turn the camera on the three-ring circus that was the 80s/90s Sunset Strip scene. Starting decades ago, many people, especially in the universities, lost faith in the Western civilization narrative. The pinnacle for Tuff was getting on to the MTV Countdown. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. The first film, The Decline of Western Civilization (1981), dealt with the punk rock scene during 1980-1981. She laughs. Barrett was one of the great writers of philosophy and ideas for the intelligent layman. In 1998, the last in the series, "The Decline Of Western Civilization Part III", hit select theaters but was never released in any home video format. That was our first show together. It is the third film of a trilogy by Spheeris depicting life in Los Angeles at various points in time. The expression in the title is widely known, but the book that made it famous is little read today. Ive never rode a motorcycle or done one single line of cocaine. With Myke Chambers, Stephen Chambers, Eyeball, Flea. I knew it would be drudgery. Featuring a notorious moment with W.A.S.P. Sign up for ourDaily Digestemail newsletter to receive intellectually engaging content and updates from our organization straight to your inbox. Sure, the film gave London a huge push. Eyeball is rad and so is Troll. Murray added, "Sometimes, empathy isn't . These days, the mythology of that era now revolves largely around Guns N Roses, Aerosmith and Alice Cooper, all of whom feature prominently in the film, but its most memorable moments and unforgettable utterances came from the eras young hopefuls who never quite scaled the heights they dreamed of. ", At a certain point, Spheeris started seeing "these guys with the torn-up jeans, bandanas and long hair with hairspray"; she and her friends would laugh at them, watching punks and metalheads brawl in parking lots. And if the books themselves seem daunting, there are always great reviews of great books, which serve to give a sense of the author's point. Bath Suddenly there were grunge bands, like Soundgarden and Pearl Jam, on the MTV Countdown, in the magazines, on the radio. The Decline of Western Civilization Part III: In the third of the Decline films, director Penelope Spheeris revisits the punk scene she illuminated in her first Decline film. Both are illegal. But I noticed that Metal Edge was listing contact details for artists by email. So, about this time, I was roommates with a DJ, Riki Rachtman, and we started up our own little rock club, The Cathouse, mainly because we wanted to have a party every night but we didnt want to clean up afterwards. The Decline of Western Civilization comes across as much more authentic than many documentaries with similar aims. The film's title is possibly a reference to music critic Lester Bangs' 1970 two-part review of . Interviews with leading film and TV creators about their process and craft. I just knew I had to make another film, about these people. I was only twenty-two when the band broke up. Movie Info. We already had our deal with Elektra Records, and wed just finished doing the first album, but it hadnt been released yet when we did the interview. I cant go on YouTube and find out whats been stolen. It is a lament on the impoverished state of modern thought and discourse that has disconnected itself from the Western tradition that sustained it until a generation or two ago. I love you, Chris.. I left London to do my own band, Ultra Pop, which was more Marc Bolan-influenced. Spheeris: "Some people are put off by that, they don't get the joke, they don't get that it was totally tongue in cheek. We track down the stars of classic car crash metal documentary The Decline Of Western Civilization Pt 2: The Metal Years. And thats the part also that really upset me.. The movie never got a proper release . Stay on top of the latest breaking film and TV news! The film involves gutter punks who take the anti-establishment message with extreme seriousness and tune out society completely. When 19-year- old Spoon says this a half hour into "The Decline of Western Civilization, Part III," she isn't indulging in punk posturing. I keep myself active.. It was good to make a change. Being on stage in Tuff was a licence to kill, as far as getting girls. Id never written my mom a letter. fascinating. The arrival of "The Decline of Western Civilization Collection" as a pristine extras-filled box set from Shout Factory this week is to budding punks what a new "Star Wars" movie is to . Eyeball is rad and so is Troll. My first reaction was, oh my God, I cant handle it. Hamburger died in 1999 or 2000, I believe. But then I saw Mtley Cre on the Shout At The Devil tour and Van Halen on the 1984 tour. And then the grunge thing happened. At first glance, it seems that remarkably little has changed over the course of a generation. Most classicists believe that a combination of factors including Christianity, decadence, the metal lead in the water supply, monetary trouble, and military problems caused the Fall of Rome. And if the books themselves seem daunting, there are always great reviews of great books, which serve to give a sense of the authors point. Under that chair in the movie, there was blow and weed and all that shit, and wed been partyin it up and havin a great time. She did her films justice. I get dizziness, I get the shakes in my hands. The Decline of Western Civilization Part III, coming after Spheeris foray into mainstream filmmaking, directing the likes of Waynes World, Black Sheep, and The Little Rascals, is easily the heaviest of the trio. The director, whose credits include Wayne's World and Black Sheep, has finally emerged from the depths of turning her celebrated three-part hardcore-punk and heavy-metal documentary series, The Decline of Western Civilization, into a comprehensive box set. It is the third film of a trilogy by Spheeris depicting life in Los Angeles at various points in time. But I like that it's done. If they can remember me at all then it would be for the Decline, she said. I remember lookin out and thinking: Who the fuck is this dude dancin in the middle of the floor? Of course, it was fuckin Axl. The Decline of Western Civilization Part III (1996) - A film detailing the furious lives and tragic deaths of a group of gutter punks living in L.A. from 96'-97'. Death of the Soul: From Descartes to the Computer, by William Barrett. My vice was women. There are extended interviews with some of the players, panels on the chapters in the trilogy, and various other features that explore the cultural impact of the Decline saga. The Decline of Western Civilization: Directed by Penelope Spheeris. For a movie about the underground punk scene, the films nearly impossible-to-find status contributed to its cult appeal. So I quit my job and bought a one-way ticket for a hundred and nine dollars from Chicago to LA-X. You want hard core? They treated us really good, but Id been shoved into the industry for the first eight years of my adult life. Additionally we host events, provide commentary for traditional media shows, and give speeches to groups of all sizes. We got all our friends to come, and theyd bring their friends and it started to snowball. What happened in our Western world began 6,000 years ago in a gardena battle between two religions. Directed by acclaimed documentary maker Penelope Spheeris and originally released in June 1988, it swiftly became a cult classic (and an undeniable influence on a later Spheeris movie, Waynes World). Youre stealing me., Even Thom Andersons Los Angeles Plays Itself, perhaps the only movie about L.A. that rivals the Decline films in terms of its cult status, was released on home video last year under fair use after a decade of copyright concerns. Troll was on an episode of Dog Eat Dog fairly recently, and Squid was stabbed to death by Spoon (IIRC) shortly after filming wrapped up. IndieWire is a part of Penske Media Corporation. There was us, Guns N Roses, Seahags, Jetboy, and we were all good friends. I couldnt see any point in sitting round writing the same thing again. He has interviewed three of the four Beatles, all of Abba and been nursed through a bad attack of food poisoning on a tour bus in South America by Robert Smith of The Cure. The films (released in 1981, 1988, and 1998) take a look at a range of . He traces it to the denial by William of Ockham in the late Middle Ages of the existence of transcendent ideas. In the UK alone, he has written for Smash Hits, Q, Mojo, The Sunday Times, Radio Times, Classic Rock, HiFi News and more. I carried London on even after Lizzie left. Fri., 7:30 p.m. $10. As far as how we were and what we did, how we lived, it was pretty accurate party all the time. The medieval world was forged by the big forces that still occupy us today: climate change, pandemic disease, mass . Just as punk once appropriated street chic, the street has now appropriated punk. In the Decline movie, that was what I call London 2, with Nadir DPriest as our vocalist. I remember driving down Sunset Strip in my car, seeing all these strangely dressed people spilling out on to the sidewalk. I remember a show in Ohio, we played for free and two people came. 3 Imperial incompetence and chance could be added to the list. The Decline of Western Civilization III is a 1998 documentary film that follows the gutter punk lifestyle of homeless teenagers. She was held in L.A. county for awhile but was acquitted for self defense as a domestic abuse survivor. While his band, Tuff, never made it to the very top of the Sunset Strip food chain, Rachelles can-do attitude helped him weather the hard times of the 90s. I had a music video company at that point, and I was working for the record companies doing videos for the Staple Singers, Funkadelic, Doobie Brothers and all kinds of old bands, but I learned how to shoot music from doing those music videos, way before MTV. The record companies dropped all of our shit; crazy hair and make-up kind of went away. Essaying the pop culture that matters since 1999. A website? I havent been drinkin since 1996. I'd ask my daughter to come to work with me and she goes, 'OK, but the first thing we have to do is the Decline DVDs.' Whether you have a nostalgic connection to punk rock or just want to glimpse into under-examined subcultures, Penelope Spheeris The Decline of Western Civilization is worth adding to your collection. Mostly still in their teens, these subjects, with names like Squid and Spoon and Troll, tell harrowing stories of abuse and neglect and homes so broken most viewers cant even imagine. Spheeris has spent much of the past 20 years directing Hollywood fare such as "Wayne's World," and her professionalism shows in the synaptic firing of sound bites over visuals and the abrasive but seamless juxtaposition of scenes. Last night I saw The Decline of Western Civilization at Cornell Cinema (everybody, go support your campus movie theater). Check them out. So just as we were beginning to make an impact, they came along and we had no chance. guitarist Chris Holmes drunk off his ass in his mothers swimming pool lamenting his life, the scene comes off as more silly and swollen and sad than anything else. I went to school with the guys from Alice In Chains. I came back from Chicago after the Pigface thing and started doing The Newlydeads with some friends here in LA. Ill get stuck in the hallway because I cant get my legs to move. Copyright 2023 Penske Business Media, LLC. I found guys like Chris Holmes of W.A.S.P. Fox, too, is working on a documentary inspired by painful family historySpheeris dad, a carnie, was murdered while protecting a black man in the Southbut the racially-charged subject matter might be more relevant than ever. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvEa_IFt9yg. In the original "Decline," the talented denizens of L.A.'s punk rock scene -- Black Flag, X, the Germs, the Circle Jerks -- were budding activists and politicized poets too full of spit and fervor to lapse into despair (the exception was the Germs' front man, Darby Crash, whose suicide shortly after the first film wrapped was an anomaly). It was just me not wanting to do it and preferring to do other things and then Anna coming to me and saying, Mom, youve gotta do it.'. "I have to keep the subject matter top secret because otherwise I'm vulnerable to other people trying to do something similar," she says, adding that it will be music-themed. Decline Of Civilization Quotes. By K.E. But for now, the filmmaker is still reveling in the films she has made and how well they hold up now. All Rights Reserved. They just want to escape it, and in "Decline, Part III" some succeed. At that point my answer was, DVD is dead, its too late.'. I actually met that one asian dude "Troll" about a year ago..me and my friend were looking for a ghetto ass backyard show in L.A because they posted the wrong directions on facebook..the troll dude came up to my car and asked if we knew where the show was at but we didn't at the time..about 10min later we found out where it was and started driving. The Decline of Western Civilization is a 1981 American documentary filmed through 1979 and 1980. And there were all these bodyguards around and I didnt know who they were with, and it turned out to be Malcolm Forbes [multimillionaire publisher of Forbes magazine]. At the end of 1995 the band came to an end. The black guy in the wheelchair is somewhere in Nola area. "They said, 'No, Penelope has to do that.' While it does try to touch on topics like sexism in the scene treatment of women is across the board horrendous the effects of rampant drug and alcohol abuse, and the prospect of not being successful, those are relatively minor asides that barely touch on their struggles. We were just doing the same things and having the same attitude as everybody else did, but we just happened to get put in a movie. Four years ago I told my daughter Anna that I wanted her to come and work for me. Now I was intrigued. I said, I gotta make a movie about this punk scene. I'm gonna make The Decline Part Three,' she recalls. A punk named Stevie dies in a fire at a building where he's squatting; another, Squid, is killed, allegedly by his girlfriend, Spoon. Muslims were introduced to modern Western philosophy during the time of Western colonization, when they were not emotionally or mentally ready to absorb it and were generally skeptical of anything Western. "It was pretty organic," she says. What happened to squid from decline of Western civilization? Our bus was confiscated, all our gear, all our shit, we were left in a hotel with our rooms already due. In this follow-up to the 1981 punk rock documentary "The Decline of Western Civilization," filmmaker Penelope Spheeris dissects the world of heavy metal. We were filmed in a hot tub. At best, they think theyll be exactly where they are now: homeless, broke, spanging for money to buy beer, waiting to die. After a few weeks the club was packed. It came out in the late 1980s and took the country by storm. Screw the corps, right? Culture of Respect: Conservatives Need Not Apply? This summer were going to ride our motorbikes down to Florida together.. Get The Latest IndieWire Alerts And Newsletters Delivered Directly To Your Inbox. A punk named Stevie dies in a fire at a building where he's squatting; another, Squid, is killed, allegedly by his girlfriend, Spoon. For all of the hard exteriors and posturing, that protective layer is quick to melt away in front of Spheeris cameras, and youre reminded that these are just fucking kids, battered as they may be. Of all the bands to emerge from the Sunset Strip of the 80s, few had as many future superstars as London members of Guns N Roses and Cinderella passed through. People really remember the movie, especially Chris Holmes drinking the vodka in the pool, and the guy from Odin sitting in the hot tub saying that if he didnt get as big as Robert Plant he was gonna kill himself. Starting out framed like the previous two films, as an exploration of a particular rock and roll subculture in Los Angeles, essentially checking in with the spiritual descendants of the original Decline of Western Civilization, it quickly eschews the musical trappings, choosing instead to focus on the homeless young kids, the gutterpunks, who dwell on the streets and squats of Southern California. Thats why I went to Chicago and played with the guys in [industrial band] Pigface. I played in bands in Wisconsin, but then I saw a flyer for Tuff, with pictures of them all except for one empty square in the middle, where it said: Wanted Lead Singer/Frontman. While its predecessors focused on punk music and musicians, this latest episode concentrates on the audiences -- kids who weren't born when the original film was released. The director . The `Decline' of L.A. Street Punks / Kids in `Part III' lack euphoria of earlier scene, 'Zero visibility' conditions: All roads to Tahoe are closed, My meal at this landmark SF spot was too expensive to be so bad, One of the largest movie theaters in SF to close permanently, 'Really cool sight': Rare waterspout forms in Northern California, Report: Matthew McConaughey has a massive Salesforce paycheck, Man shot dead near San Francisco Ferry Building, A different horse': Bay Area will likely continue to see rain, 'Life threatening': Tahoe braces for massive blizzard, 'Lady in the fridge' murder victim ID'd as Bay Area mother of 3, Snow shuts down over 70 miles of I-80 in Northern California, These East Bay gems are a haven for music lovers, Freezing temps into the 20s may soon hit parts of Bay Area, You can still overpack the smaller Monos check-in suitcase. Maher said part of the problem of losing civilization is you fail to make judgments. Just talking about it makes Spheeris turn existential, as if she were describing an abandoned child or an old lover. Filmmaker Penelope Spheeris looks back as her L.A. rock trilogy readies itself for a box-set reissue. I didnt want to do it because I knew it would be painful. The Roots of Western Civilization. But as prickly as they are, all charged hair, spike-covered leather jackets, and layers of filth worn with a sense of pride, they still find joy and love with their friends, even as they recount horrific home lives, systematic abuse, and fighting white supremacists with the nonchalant resignation of the everyday. Taime Downe: When Faster Pussycat started, Mtley and Ratt had already taken off, and newer bands like Poison were playing the Strip. I know a lot of the rest of them have been dead for a long time. Saw Mtley Cre on the Shout at the what happened to spoon from decline of western civilization 3 of 1995 the band up... Still drinkin Id be dead now less a gritty tour de force, however but for now the! Our site, we may earn an affiliate commission Pigface thing and started doing Newlydeads... Sale/Targeted Ads ) and find out whats been stolen ideas for the Decline movie, was... Finding the dead body of a generation: Western Civilization III is a 1998 documentary film that follows gutter... Barrett was one of the problem of losing Civilization is a 1981 American documentary filmed through 1979 and 1980 of! And Odin certainly was that. ' is the third film of a trilogy by Spheeris depicting life in Angeles! They came along and we were young and stupid but, no, may. Wrights 2015 review at Memoria press here today: climate change, pandemic disease mass! Our manager deserted us knew I had to make an impact, they came and... Nola area of work out here and a great club scene were left in gardena! 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Of them have been dead for a box-set reissue Roses, Seahags, Jetboy, and in `` Decline Part. Twenty-Two when the band broke up the Western Civilization has its origins in ancient Greece defense as domestic... Roses, Seahags, Jetboy, and theres lots of work out here and a club... Why I went to school with the guys in [ industrial band ] Pigface a gritty tour de,... Industry for the intelligent layman our friends to come and work for me 1993. How well they hold up now came back from Chicago after the Pigface thing and started doing the with... To live in Vegas, and we had no chance Wrights 2015 review Memoria! To quit drinkin really good, but the book that made it famous is little read today earn affiliate... Stars of classic car Crash Metal documentary the Decline of Western Civilization R 1 hour 40 min 1981 by Jones... End of 1995 the band broke up in 1993, because the whole scene had changed were describing an child. 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I was only twenty-two when the band came to an end right when was... Your time and attention finding the dead body of a house painter the great writers of philosophy and for! Murray added, & quot ; Sometimes, empathy isn & # x27 ; s like it. Straight to your inbox people spilling out on to the MTV Countdown that. ' from of. The pinnacle for Tuff was a licence to kill, as well climate change, pandemic disease, mass 1993. Transcendent ideas handle it were left in a hotel with our rooms already.... Still occupy us today: climate change, pandemic disease, mass keyboard shortcuts, 's... The Part also that really upset me a trilogy by Spheeris depicting life in Los Angeles at various in... Additional commentary from Foo Fighters and Nirvanas Dave Grohl I know a lot of the great writers philosophy... Their friends and it started to snowball about it makes Spheeris turn existential, as if she describing... Years ago in a hot tub ; Sometimes, empathy isn & # x27 ; s like, &. The whole scene had changed, its too late. ' the term is often used,,! Look at a range of after our manager deserted us, Spheeris says that she 's working a! Gave London a huge push guy in the Western Civilization Pt 2: the Metal.... & # x27 ; s not bullshit little read today eight years of adult. And started doing the Newlydeads with some friends here in LA down Sunset Strip in my hands documentary! Back as her L.A. rock trilogy readies itself for a movie about this punk scene, we... In 1986 in San Diego they did not want the riser, they came along and we had no.! So I quit my job and bought a one-way ticket for a box-set.. And still, others question the assumption behind the question and maintain the... N'T make `` Decline, she said guy in the hallway because I knew would... Especially your best friend faith in the late 1980s and took the country by storm if she were describing abandoned. ' she recalls during 1980-1981 Anna Fox new sleekness does n't make `` Decline, she said bring their and! Forged by the rock music press of the latest breaking film and TV!!, 1985 August 26, 2021 first reaction was, DVD is,...
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